Marathon Man
Episode Title: Marathon Man
Episode Number: 002
Guest: Ben Pattinson
Host: Will Finlay
In this episode, I explore our theme of community as I talk to Ben Pattinson who is training for the Manchester Marathon. Ben is an Assistant Headteacher at a school in Birmingham. This discussion takes a deep dive into his training, favourite build up races in the West Midlands, his reason for running plus much more!
Key Moments:
01:30 - Ben's feelings for his upcoming marathon in Manchester
03:00 - Finding community in running
06:20 - Using parkrun as a training tool due to friendly competition
09:14 - Ben's thoughts on the app, Runna
17:07 - Looking into Ben's Cheltenham Half Marathon Result
23:00 - Ben's thoughts for other people doing their first marathon this spring
26:10 - Creating a run club in a school environment
31:50 - Ben's favourite races in the West Midlands
39:00 - The Slog of the Marathon
40:00 - Race Day Outfit
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Watch this Episode on YouTube! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmpfK8kNi5Q
Transcript
Hello everybody and welcome back to episode number two of Run Together, Run Forever. Sticking on the theme of teachers, we had Emily Painter last week. From the same school we've got Ben Pattinson, who is doing a marathon in the next three weeks. Ben, how are you? I think it's important to start with how are you feeling for the marathon?
Ben (:I'm good thanks. I'm a bit nervous for it because obviously I think now I look back at half, I've done two half marathons and I think that a marathon is a very big step compared to that. And I think right now I'm just focused on trying to get a good time. So I think I'm not worried about the distance in terms of finishing it. I think it's more about being a bit competitive with myself and making sure I get the desired time that I want to finish in really.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, absolutely. You say about the competition in yourself, so is it something where, I know a lot of people who do them for charity, things like that, is it something you're like, right, I've done a half marathon, I want to prove it to myself now, this is the next step, and that's what I can do.
Ben (:Yeah, I think it's one of those things that's like always been on in the back of my mind to actually do a marathon. And I think it was one of those things that like I did a half and I've done not two. And I think that now it was well actually the ultimate test is a marathon, isn't it? Obviously, so I thought like, actually, let's try and challenge myself, try and do the marathon. And I'd probably say in the last year to 18 months, I've probably got more into my running than I've ever been. Stopped playing as much team sport.
Will Finlay (:Hmm.
Mm.
Yeah, nice.
Ben (:and I've just focused more solely on my running rather than doing my team. I still do play team sport, but not as much.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, yeah. Do you still find like a community aspect in the running? You know, in terms of like when you go out, do you find yourself running in groups or do you do a lot of the majority of running by yourself?
Ben (:I do a lot on my own. think what I do find weird is that whenever you're out running and you see another runner, there's always that like, you always have like a nod to each other and the thumbs up and stuff like that. I've got like a friend who's done three marathons and she's the one who's basically got me to sign up and do this marathon. We don't run together because we live like 45 minutes away. So realistically, we were trying to, we were gonna try and do a few runs to match up, but she's had a few injury problems.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, yeah, the little ones. Yeah.
I am.
Mmm.
Ben (:So we haven't managed to do that. But I do run with my partner as well. So she's obviously not as quick as me, but still like is committed in terms of running. occasionally if she needs a bit of extra motivation and I've got like a one that I don't need to run a certain tempo on, I will run with her just to make sure I give her that little bit of support.
Will Finlay (:Go.
Yeah, nice.
Yeah, and I bet that's nice for you, it can sort of then, I find them miles where, you know, that you sort of, right, I'm gonna go out and do eight to 10K and they sort of drag, you know, having that bit of company beside you sort of sorts you out.
Ben (:Yeah, think sometimes you've got that little bit of a... Like you're having a chat, you're a distracted. So therefore sometimes it's a little bit easier and then you also know that you're supporting someone else. So like I think it's less about what you actually need to do and then it'll be a case of, let's focus on... She might have a 5k that I do with her and then I finish off my 3k on my own so it's not so bad then. So that's quite good. Yeah, definitely.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, Splits it up nicely,
Yeah, nice. So, in terms of the marathon, is it right you've done a 20 week block? As in that was what the block, it, yeah, it's a long time, long old time.
Ben (:Yeah, I think, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and I think
the reason why I think I did that was because, well, obviously I signed up using an app called Runner, so I'd got like a 12 month subscription. And in my head, I was conscious that I've never done a marathon before. And I know that I was going on holiday during that 20 weeks. So therefore it built in a little bit of a buffer. So like, I know I'm, I think.
Will Finlay (:Okay.
Ben (:I've missed about five runs in total so far. So, and I only run three times a week. So I set it as I only want to do three runs a week. So that's all I can maintain. So I've missed just like just over a week in terms of that. So for me, I did the 20 week block knowing full well that it really was going to be an 18 one really. Yeah. Yeah, definitely.
Will Finlay (:That's nice.
You've got some wiggle room, yeah, nice.
Nice. Cause that leads nicely sort of onto my next question because, you know, I've said to the viewers last week, I'm running Paris marathon. think it's a week before Manchester and I've only done a 14 week block and the motivation is tough as in terms of, you know, it's especially when you're not funded, et cetera, things like that. It's, I completely get your pain in terms of the motivation.
Ben (:Yeah, he's AF.
Will Finlay (:So, you know, anybody who's running over 14, 15 weeks for a marathon, I've got, you know, the biggest sort of respect for really. In terms of like, I know that you're also like a regular parkrun goer. Do you often look at parkrun and think, right, parkrun is my chance to sort of introduce a bit of speed into my training? Do you always find that? Because it's that...
friendly competition where, right, these people are going to drag me around.
Ben (:Yeah, think the irony of that is I've avoided park runs during my marathon training. And the reason for that being is, like, I think I did one at Christmas and I think that on Christmas day, I think that was my actual last park run that I've done. Just because I know what I'm like, so I wouldn't be able to go to a park run unless I was running with someone who needed to run like a specific, slower time and stuff like that.
Will Finlay (:Okay, fair enough.
Okay.
Ben (:that I'll have to go flat out and that's just because I want to try and get the best time possible. I normally schedule my long runs on a Sunday. So therefore I wouldn't want to go and do a 5k flat out to then do that. yeah, do like, that's how I got into my running if I'm being honest with them in terms of that. I used to literally do park run and that was pretty much it. So COVID came obviously did a bit of running like that just because that's all the only thing you could do.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, yeah. Let's get a of new wine. Yeah, yeah.
Okay, nice.
Yeah.
Ben (:And then obviously
when that finished, it was 5Ks. And that's when I was like, think it was about, basically was just getting 24 minutes, 5Ks at that point. And then obviously sort of brought it down, brought it down, brought it down. But I do like the park run because I do think you, like, even though it's not a race, you are racing and like it gives you that, yeah. Yeah. And like, and I know like you'll, you go, that person, like my own, I went along, for example, the Arboretum, the one I do, which is the one by me, it's like.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, nice.
It is, yeah, it is, yeah, yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Ben (:It used to be a three-lap course, then they changed it to a two. And like, it would be like no one's who... I'd always try and be in a positive on the last lap in terms of taking over or being taken over. So that was my little motivation. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Yeah, yeah. So yeah.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, yeah. It's the mental battle which pushes you on. Nice. Yeah, it's,
yeah, good. But no, it's like, I always think that with part-running, you know, I said, again, I said to Payne, to my family, are very much advocates for part-run, not only to have the social afterwards, but it's important to get that, you know, that running your legs on a Saturday morning, because it sets you up nicely for the day. And as you said, where, you know, it's where you started your running journey.
Ben (:Yeah.
Will Finlay (:and then you progress all the way through. Yeah, nice. So going back to what you said about, ⁓ about runner, you mentioned how you've got a runner, a runner plan and we were talking in sort of the pre podcast podcast, the tiny little bit we had that, you know, we were talking about how there's been a bit of controversy surrounding runner and how it's sort of overtraining people who potentially have
just started, what are your opinions on that? Where you sort of think, do you think that runner potentially if people don't have that much ⁓ insight into running, it could over train people potentially?
Ben (:Yeah, think definitely, think if someone's, if you put down that you were available for four or five runs a week, it would just plan that for you nonstop. So I think you've got to be bit clever and a bit, you've got to know your own body as well. And I think some people, well, all runners are probably guilty of it. We've all run with niggles. We won't rest. When I look back to my...
Will Finlay (:Absolutely.
Ben (:The last half marathon I did, so Cheltenham in September, I pretty much didn't run for the last two weeks because I had got a few niggles, my knee was hurting. So I think that potentially that did me a favor and I basically rested for two weeks before I did the half. But that's me knowing my body and I think some people would probably be like, no, or if, and again like.
Will Finlay (:See you when you complete the crash.
Ben (:I'm talking that I know we've both played football and stuff in the past. You know your own body, don't you? So you know like what you can and can't do. And I think it doesn't take into that consideration. Now I don't think that it also like takes into people's body weights for a runner. Cause I don't think it does. I can't remember. I know I've thought a bit as a year ago, but like I'd class myself as a heavy runner. Cause I'm not, my physique's not what you class as a runner's physique. You know what I'm like. I'm not saying I'm fat, but I'm not exactly stick thin. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, No, but you're a strong guy. Yeah,
yeah, yeah.
Ben (:So
like I said, so I think like it doesn't take that into consideration. Like I was reading something, I don't know how true this is, but you might be able to tell me that the average runner, like someone who's like a runner, is about 65 kg roughly normally.
Will Finlay (:Yeah,
that's why I'm about 63, 64 kg and it's... Yeah. And it's... There's a lot of load to go through your legs, yeah.
Ben (:whereas I'm 90. So therefore, that's a lot to take in. if you...
Yeah. And again, like, and I think what I would say with it as well is ⁓ I've done no strength training. No, I know that's my own fault. And I know that I should have included it. And it does suggest it, but it doesn't put that in the plan for you. So in terms of a basis for an app, I think it's very good. I like it because it's got the set runs, the times, and I've really...
enjoyed that it's got specific times. I really enjoyed the 10-par runs but I think that's because of the 5k and stuff like that and I think that's really good but I think as an app it probably could be a bit more it should ask those things and make sure that right you're doing this week we're going to take a run off you and we're going to tell you that you need to go to the gym and do something like I don't know I think maybe that probably would be for some people would be more beneficial I think yeah.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, no.
Yeah,
get what you mean. the strength training is a tough one because for somebody like me who is at university, it's probably a easier. for somebody like you, in an important role in a school, it's like, right, I'm only just about getting the time to run in. Where am I going to get the gym session in? So have you found, is that what you found? There's times where I to work. It's like, especially the long dark nights we've had.
Ben (:Yeah.
Yeah.
Will Finlay (:in the winter is that like, Jesus, that's tough to get out.
Ben (:Yeah.
Yeah, I think for me definitely in terms of that's why I've not done it. I think part of the reason is like I'd say that like sporty background in terms of that, like your legs are generally okay and you can cope with it. I know I'm gonna say that when I'm like on this weekend I've got to run 34K and my legs will be dead. But I said like yeah, I would like if I'm looking back at.
Will Finlay (:Mm.
Yeah.
Ben (:if I'm gonna do another. So I have got the half booked in two weeks after my marathon as well. So I'm doing the Birmingham half. That's to do with my partner. But like if I said, if I ever did another half or anything like that, I'd do a much smaller training program, like 12 weeks, but I would incorporate some of those things. And I think because you've got that base, wouldn't like, okay, I can miss one of these runs and do a like a strength session instead. But that's because think if you've been doing it for year and you've got used to it, I wouldn't want a wrist for me.
Will Finlay (:Okay, nice. Yeah.
Lowest strength.
Ben (:in this block it was more about let's get these miles done, let's get your body used to running more than you've ever ran. And then if you need to, if I ever want to do another marathon again, which I've done, I will, just because of the sheer amount of distance. But I would, you know what to tweak, you know, well actually I didn't do this last time, let's do that, I think.
Will Finlay (:No. Yeah, volume.
Yeah.
Nice. Nice. So what is it? Last long run this Sunday?
Ben (:Yeah, basically this is my hard, horrible week. So I've literally got like, I've got to do today, I've got to do a tempo run after this and it's like, I think it's like a 9k tempo broken up and then 34k is the furthest I'm ever going to run. I missed one of my long runs. I missed a long run a couple of weeks ago because I couldn't do it on Sunday. So I did a slightly shorter one on a Saturday. So that'll be the first. So I've run 28k twice.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, nice.
Ben (:And then, then
now this is a 34K, but the 28K, like that was when I really struggled with my motivation, I think, because I struggled.
Will Finlay (:Yeah,
it's, that's what it is. And like, I look back to last year and I've tried, I've had a far better block this year than I did last year, but I think I ran 30 K once last year. That was it. And it's like, and you know, so I think it's, it is tough. you say that you've got two 28 K runs in. It's like the last 14 K of a marathon is hard, but it's like, if you've got that willpower and the
Ben (:Yeah.
Will Finlay (:crowd to push you through which I know that Manchester will have. It's like, you know, that's the best thing that you can have really, isn't it, I guess.
Ben (:Yeah.
and I'll also have my carbon plates on because I don't train. So like, and I know like, the only time I train, I've got two pairs, I've got my race pair and I've got a tempo pair, so like I've got another pair that'll weigh for my tempos. Let me go and get them, I can't remember, have them. And they're Nike, I only run in Nike. I'm a very much a Nike person. So I've got, I've got my two, the ones with the red, you know the VaporFlight, the really expensive ones. I would say.
Will Finlay (:Absolutely. Do not.
what carbons are they, what shoes are they?
only really night full night kit
Yeah, yeah.
Ben (:So those are lot more race ones. And then I've got these ones on sale. I don't know. ⁓
Will Finlay (:yeah, nice. Very nice.
Which ones
are the... yeah they're the... like the... are they the threes? I think they are, yeah nice. They're nice.
Ben (:don't know, I can't remember. But again,
just because they were on sale and I was like, I need another pair because I don't want to use my bag before, I don't want to use those ones any time really. I only use those for races or if I'm going for PBs. for me, those were the, think psychologically, think it's like, and they do make a big difference every time, I know you know, that as soon as you put them on, you are springing and it does save it so much.
Will Finlay (:Yeah.
Yeah, you go.
But as you say, the fact that you weren't training them, you'll feel that on race day and that's...
Ben (:Yeah, that's my plan. So
my plan is I go out and box not my box standard, but like just a normal running lung pair that I've used and I'm like, well, if I can play through and manage to do whatever time I need to doing these, I know so mentally that I know that they'll take at least 10 seconds off. Okay, that's what I'm telling myself. So like
Will Finlay (:Yeah.
Stefan.
No,
but also it works twofold where like, the fact you're not wearing carbon shoes, because they've put that much force through your joints. If you were to wear them in your training runs, you're actually helping yourself by running your easy trainers all the time. Just by helping your legs anyway, so it works twofold really. yeah, no that's ace. So another thing that I wanted to look at was, you chelt them half marathon.
Ben (:Yeah
Yeah.
Will Finlay (:So you mentioned that was the, would you say that's the last big race you did? Really? Because I know you did that the year before as well, didn't you? So what I was going to speak about was the year before, would you say you didn't have as good a race?
Ben (:Yeah, yeah, yeah, September, yeah, The year before, yeah.
I didn't
train, I didn't train really so I didn't have a training program at all really. It was just a case of, again it was my friend who she's done it and she was like let's do it and she was like you're a runner and was like yeah yeah I said so. Didn't really train. I literally did I think about a month before or three weeks before I did an 18k run like on the canals but pulled my hamstring playing football.
Will Finlay (:Yeah.
Right.
Ben (:Like
literally just before it, about a month before I'd been on an all-inclusive holiday for two weeks. and like hadn't really trained, but in my head I was like, yeah, like I was like, ⁓ I can do this. This'll be no problem. Like I'd done a couple of like 10K races and stuff like that before. I was like, yeah, this will be fine. And literally five K into the race. So we were running together and we were only doing like five minute Ks at that point. Cause we'd gone off steady.
Will Finlay (:Yeah.
of the nation.
Ben (:I said to her, leave me, I know I can't keep this pace up for the rest of the race. And I just let her go. So it was literally 5K into the race.
Will Finlay (:I really have to...
Wow,
Compared to this year, where if I just pull up your Strava now, because I was logging through it before, ⁓ didn't you close that so quickly?
Ben (:Yeah, so this year I did, yeah. I think I did a, yeah, yeah,
Yeah, I think well, I think so what I did was I think I might finish quite quickly because there was a beer and a bloke racing together. But I what I did was like it was but we're not in a competitive way. It was like, come on, let's go together. Because I think that's the sort of you don't get that sort of community when you're running down here because it's not like they could have started five, 10 minutes before you're after it. You don't really know. But like I had done a proper block of training. I did have carbon plates for that. And like it was.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, let's push it. ⁓
Yeah, yeah.
Yay.
Ben (:It was the opposite way round, so she got a niggle, so she was like, leave me, just go, I don't want you to run with me. And I was running like, not within myself, but I was like, I felt comfortable and I would say, I struggled on the last 2k, but by then you've made it. you've got, that one, I think, so I did that, yeah, so that race I did good. I think it was the race that I finished really quickly on was the Sutton Fun Run that I did. Yeah.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, you know your race is not going to affect your race.
Sorry, that's the one, yeah. Where it
was, yeah, that was the one where you closed with like, yeah, like for, like you were sprinting. Yeah.
Ben (:Like four minutes.
Literally because it does go downhill, so it does have a
downhill finish. again, that was like, there was like ⁓ like been, it's not, I didn't, what I would say about that run was the start was rubbish. It's just not a good start. Like you started, got past the start line and had to stop and had to walk just because of everyone there. So like you was a bit agitated trying to do that. And then towards the end, you're picking off people and there was this, I say young girl, probably about your age.
Will Finlay (:Okay, bye.
Ben (:And I'd seen her and I'd been catching her and we both, to be fair to she'd kept it, she'd bombed it and she kept in front. But we were sprinting to finish with. again, yeah, that one's a weird distance. I think it was like 14k.
Will Finlay (:on it as well.
for
Yeah, because obviously I was speaking to Emily and I'll get onto this with you about your favourite races in the Midlands areas. She was saying that Sutton Fun Run wasn't one of her favourites but it's one that she'll do every year. And she was saying, yeah, it's a weird distance but I think it's about eight and a half, nine miles, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Ben (:Eight and a half mile, eight and a half mile. And I said like,
it's a hard course. And I said like, when I say it's not set up great, I think, know, like it just doesn't do waves. And I think like, it's in like, everyone's just there. So obviously I didn't know this. Just went to near the back, which is fine. Like, cause I was like, I was talking to someone. I was talking to another teacher that ran it, cause he was a runner as well. And then like for me, I'm very much, when I start, I wanna start and I wanna go and I don't wanna stop.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, go.
Hmm.
Yeah.
You want to get moved?
Ben (:So ⁓
I got frustrated because I felt like for the first minute of the race, ⁓ I'd lost a minute of my time. ⁓ When I'm doing something like that, I want it to be a timed race and want it to be competitive.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, absolutely.
But then the best thing is you can finish strong. So there you go.
Ben (:Yeah,
so literally, I don't think, was running, because I had a bottle in my vest and that came flying out because I was going that quick pounding down, it just literally flew out.
Will Finlay (:Mmm.
going that fast. There you go. Perfect.
But no, it's a go, go back to Cheltenham before we move on. So the time, what was it about? Was it 1.36? You were saying, you know, when you first started, you were running 24 minutes for 5k. And then really what you're doing there is, know, 4.36, 4.35, 4.36, which really is, you know, it's 23 and a half minute pace four times in a row.
Ben (:Yeah, 136, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
I think it was 436 a K on our visual third ford. Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Will Finlay (:It shows that the training for you must be working in terms of what you're building towards. So must be dead pleased with that.
Ben (:Yeah, definitely.
Yeah, to be fair, I wanted a sub 145, that was my goal. yeah, the problem is now, because you're almost close to 130, then it's like, that's all we... Yeah, because I think to get to that is to knock another six minutes off. I think it's like 410, something like that, roughly. Which, I don't know, I'm getting too old for that.
Will Finlay (:Okay, so you smash that then.
Now it gets tough.
Ben (:Well, not sure what I mean, not sure. That's my excuse.
Will Finlay (:No, very good. So what would we've we've sort of touched on it, but what would be your advice to somebody who is looking and thinking, right, I'm going to I'm going to try and do a marathon. I'm you know, I'm a competent level of runner, but I want to push myself to to this marathon distance. What would you say is the
important thing to sort of think about if you are going to do it because it is such a long way and I think people forget that your body breaks down when you're doing this. What should I really be looking for?
Ben (:Yeah.
Yeah,
I think for me personally, think have they what races have you done beforehand previously? like, like for me, parkrun is always a good basis to start because a 5k like if you're a competent runner, like that's a good distance for anyone. It doesn't matter what your time is like in terms of that. Like if you can do that nonstop and keep going, that's a good one. Have you then done a 10k? I'd always try and if I'm glad I've done a half and I'm glad I've done it twice.
Will Finlay (:Yeah.
Ben (:because I think that's a good distance. think it's actually quite a nice distance. Yeah, it's like in a sick way, like it's like one of those things that you say it's actually quite a nice distance because like, I think if I was ever get like, I don't think I'd have gone for a marathon if I'd not done a half because I think I've got confidence from doing the one that I did and then the second one where I got a really good time. I think that's given me a lot of confidence. So, and then I would just be like, give yourself that time. So I'd like, you'd have to follow some sort of plan.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, I always think that's nice, isn't it?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ben (:So whether that meant you downloaded one of these apps or you've got someone. Now, I potentially wouldn't run with like, for example, if me and you ran together, wouldn't benefit you or it wouldn't benefit me because like, cause it would just be like, it'd be too hard for me or it'd be too easy for you. And I know, like, so I think you've got to make sure, or you join a running club. I think you've to have some sort of structure to it and you've got to be committed. If like, I think.
Will Finlay (:I got what you mean,
Ben (:I've probably got through on the bare minimum you can do in terms of runs per week. I think three is probably the minimum that you should do. And that's just, yeah. that, yeah, so that's in my head, that's why I've set that goal up in terms of that. But yeah, I think for me, like, if you can do half and you're competent, push yourself, because I think it's one of those things, isn't it? Like less than 1 % of the population have done a marathon. So.
Will Finlay (:But you're doing a far longer block than everybody else.
Yeah is, Somehow,
because I feel like everybody does a belly marathon so somehow it's 1 % but I don't know how.
Ben (:Yeah. Yeah. But I can imagine,
like I said, and I think it's something to be really proud of. The only thing that I wish that I'm a bit, the only thing I'm frustrated with is I wish I'd have done it for some, good cause. Cause I'm doing it anyway. So like it wouldn't have meant, I don't think it would have made a difference. Like I'd have got my place and then, like there's a couple of things, I've had like a friend's husband that passed away and stuff like that. So actually I wish like I'd have done it and raised it for a good cause. Yeah.
Will Finlay (:Mm. Okay.
Yeah, it gives you some more purpose
to actually do it.
Ben (:Just because
like I know I'm going to do it anyway. So if I could have raised even if it was 500 pounds, well that 500 pound could have gone to a good cause where someone would have done it and it would have been like even more motivation to make sure that you finish it and do what you need to do.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, look.
Yeah, absolutely. Because a lot of people will do like I'm running for Samaritans this year and the ramp for dementia last year and know, dementia especially is one that's very close to our family, which was great. Samaritans, not as much, it was not that it was important to do that, but it was more, it gives you that extra motivation as well. I can't really see where you're coming. Speaking about where you came on from, about run clubs.
Ben (:Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, definitely.
Will Finlay (:You set up your own run club at the school with the students. How have they sort of like adapted to that? Because I know some students, especially when I was at school, wouldn't eat, like me included to be honest, wouldn't have even cared about running distance. Like how far are you running with the guys and are they enjoying it?
Ben (:So on the whole, yes, I think we were very skeptical about starting this because I think actually getting kids to actually run is quite a hard thing and their motivation. think working for PE for the last 10 to 15 years, have noticed a decline in kids' activity levels. And fundamentally, the reason why we've brought this in is because actually if we can get kids to be
not necessarily get a love for running, but have a good level of fitness. It's going to benefit us across every sport that we do. We've had some really good success stories. So there's a couple of kids that when you, in terms of body shape and stuff like that, that just don't stop. They will run and like, they will just crack on. There's some kids in there that we've got. So there's one lad that will, he's already, he already does park runs and stuff outside of school. So like to tell it to him, he doesn't. So when we've got the breaks, he just carries on.
Will Finlay (:Yes.
Berlin.
I know.
Ben (:and
he just carries on running. it's not hindering him and he records it on an app. he's got logs, we make sure that we say to him now, like, how far have you gone? So like last week, he managed to do the 5K in the lesson. So he's managed to do that. In terms of distances, so far we've done a 1K challenge and a 2K challenge. we measured it out where they had to run nonstop to get those badges. And the majority of them did that. I think the plan is to do...
Will Finlay (:That's right.
No.
Ben (:And when we come back after half term to get to the three, four and five. And we're going to incorporate int. So we're going to change it up a little bit. So because we've moved on to athletics, so we're going to actually get them to do it like on the track and stuff like that a little bit more. So to mix it up, because obviously the problem with running at school is we're literally just running laps of like the netball courts, which is a bit like it is a bit boring for all of us. But on the whole, like the kids buying levels has been really good. So the last run we did, so last week was
Will Finlay (:Yes.
on the track.
of the plate.
Yes.
Good.
Ben (:a 10 minute run, three minute rest, 10 minute run. And the kids are doing it because they know like we're doing it with them. So I think that's part of the things I think like, yeah. Like I said, we've got like, so when there's like a range of people there, so I would probably say in terms of the runner, I'm the only probably like not natural, but the one who actually runs outside of school. And then we've obviously got Clare is the head of department. She's a little bit older, so she's in her 40s, but her and her sister run.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, they're like the teachers that are.
Yeah, I'm on it, running to you.
Ben (:they do like 5Ks so their challenge is they want to do 5K every week so they want to do 52 a year so that's what they're able to do. Yeah so like I think and I think and like the kids on the whole have taken to it I'd probably say you've got like a really good buy and obviously not everyone does it and stuff like that but like unless they've got a physical note they take part in it and they do it.
Will Finlay (:and it sort of pushed them into it as well.
Okay, so
is it incorporated in PE lessons or is it is it open lines? Okay.
Ben (:Yeah, literally
one lesson a week of the year seven curriculum for pretty much three quarters of the year is what I run a week. So they will do, so we have it on a Thursday morning with our year sevens, we will run with them every Thursday morning and get it that way, obviously. And we've done it in the rain. We've done it, like, just because we've said, like, if I'm running, like, it doesn't matter what weather, whatever it is. Obviously, we've missed the odd one or two and stuff like that. And then at the start, had to, so.
Will Finlay (:That's ice.
Ben (:The second lesson, so like, we're on the end of the week, if we had a particular poor engagement, we did make them run again. And we did that really at the start and we haven't had to do it again. And I think that's like, they know. Yeah, so I think, and I said, I think on the whole, it's been a real positive. And what we want to do by the end of the year is arrange for us to go to a park run. So there's a couple near our school and then we want to go with the school and do it together and we want to all run.
Will Finlay (:bro. I guess we won't want to run any further. Yeah.
Ben (:We haven't set a date for that, I know that we're on about doing it. even, like for us, even if we got one kid turn up, that's one kid that would have never done it before. yeah.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, that was my
point where it's like, your school's very much like, because, you know, maybe the parents weren't into sport or running. it's then the next line is the, I guess, the school's responsibility. And then the school are really pushing for these people. It's great when you hear like the success stories that you're saying of where you've got one lad who's going.
recording it on his own app and he's getting the endorphins from it and it probably, I don't know if you've seen, works twofold in terms of behaviour at school as well and stuff like that.
Ben (:And I think yeah, that's what we're hopeful. We hope that if it'd be like living like that, gives them that, like some kids do just need to burn energy. But like, if you went to them, right, just go and run, run for like 20 minutes. They can't do it because they haven't got that internal pacing. So that's the big thing that we've got into them, like saying, like we will say, like we all run at different paces. I don't need you to run flat out. I need you to run to do it for five, 10, whatever we're doing it for. now they've got so many weeks in.
Will Finlay (:Yes.
Ben (:they know what it is. Some kids still run with friends and within themselves, which you're gonna do, which is fine. But the majority of kids are running on their own in terms of their own patients, so it has been pretty good.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, I'm not sure.
That's ace. So obviously the schools in Birmingham and my question which I alluded to before was what are your favourite races in the West Midlands? Because I was saying to Emily last week that sometimes I think the West Midlands can get a bit of a bad rap for sort of running whereas I actually think it's really good especially if you sort of some of the areas. what are like some because you said you're doing the Birmingham half what is it that attracted you to that?
Ben (:Yeah.
So my partner works at another school and their school do it every year and do it to raise money and they do it ⁓ as a group. And Elina was umming and ahhing whether she wanted to do it. And I said, well, I'll run it with you if you need to. So I said, the options are on that race day that we do it like that. That I'd either run with her to get her her time or she tells me to go away and I'll just go and try and get a PP.
Will Finlay (:Okay.
Ben (:And I think that will be the second one. I don't think she wants me to run for that distance, which is fair enough. But in terms of that one, think, because it's a local one as well, I know it's quite a tough one. So in terms of like, yeah, it's supposed to be really hilly. And to be fair, the medal that's come out this year is fantastic as well. Yeah, it's like ⁓ a tribute to Ozzy Osbourne a bit as well. So we're quite fortunate like that. And it's one that's on our doorstep, so there's no reason why we shouldn't do it.
Will Finlay (:Try it.
Thank you.
Okay, yes, Hilly is next.
and notice.
⁓ cool.
Yeah, that's some sort of feel like, you know, it's in the community, do it. That's nice.
Ben (:⁓
Yeah, in terms of yeah, in terms of all
the races. Apart from park runs, the only other the only other race in the Midlands that I've done is the Aldridge 10k which tough. Yeah, the last k and a half there's like an incline and it's really steep. But there's two like I like it because it's run by a local run club.
Will Finlay (:Okay, nice. How did you find that? Because that's got a big hill in the middle of it, it?
Ben (:So it's their event. So it's called the Aldridge Running Club that run it. So I'm like, perfect. I don't mind going to support that. And because it's my only 10Ks that I really run, it is my PB type. That's my PB course for it. So in terms of that, I do like it. It's a tough course, but it's one lap. It's real good vibes. And it's only about 400, 500 people that enter it. So it's not a very big one. The only concern with that one is you're not allowed to use headphones.
Will Finlay (:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
Get it.
Yeah.
Ben (:it because they don't close all the roads off so that's a bit of a
Will Finlay (:Right, okay. Yeah,
so there's some guys actually who are coming on the podcast in a couple of weeks who sort of their thing is they do YouTube videos and they have the head cam and stuff and you can see it like half of it they're running like on the pavement on the side of the road and the Aldridge 10K and it's yeah, so thank you.
Ben (:Yeah.
Yeah, So like,
they're closed, it's partially closed, so that's fine. So you can do that. But like, it's just, that's like a bit of a tough one, like in terms of not, like for me, listening to music just like blanks everything out. Plus, then you get your splits so you know what time you're on. So you're not having to look at your watch, not having to look at your phone. So, and then the, probably my favorite park run is the Chase Water Watch. ⁓
Will Finlay (:Yeah.
Nice.
Ben (:It's not easy but it's just a nice, I think it's a nice challenging one lap race. Because I find that one easier than the beacon one and I don't know why. Even though it should be harder but I don't think it is.
Will Finlay (:⁓ And it's really nice, yeah.
Yeah, I get what you mean.
Beacon's twisty and turny in it where it's like, I always find that, I sort of think it's because it's just a recreational park, but it's like, I always think that course would be so much faster if they just like, you know that bit where you sort of have to go round back on yourself and like that at the very end. put a line straight through it, it'd be so much quicker. it's, no I do get what mean, Chasewater is a, personally it's really nice looking park run.
Ben (:Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
setting.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Will Finlay (:⁓ and then it's a really nice, it's a good route as well. tough going up probably 3.5 to 4k.
Ben (:Yeah, that's the back,
it? The back, it's like when you do the four, I think it's about one and a half, two K in. It's that uphill bit there. But then after that, once you've gone up on that, most of it's then pretty much downhill, isn't it? So yeah, it's like... So that one is a nice one. The only problem with that one is it's the weather, isn't it? It's weather depending, because if it's been rubbish, like now, this would be the perfect time of year to go and run it because it'd be nice. I tell you what, one I have done that's really challenging is the Dudley Park run.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, you're on the back straight and... Yeah.
⁓ Yeah. B.
Okay, my dad's done that, yeah. Yeah.
Ben (:Just
because my partner used to live that way and it was like five minutes round the corner from her. You start on the track and you finish on the track. So you do a K on the track first. No, you do, yeah basically you you end up doing a K on the track in total or something like that. But then you end up running like a longer canal path up like a big hill. However, one that you could probably win because there's not many runners that do it well. Like I think I finished 12th and that was not when I was quick.
Will Finlay (:I'm finished with this one.
Hey, ⁓ Okay.
Right.
Go for it.
Ben (:So like in terms of wanting to go for one that you want to win or something like that or get really high rank positions. Yeah, so that would be one that would be worthwhile for you I think because I think that would be something you wouldn't be able to wear your carbons though just because... But yeah, one I haven't done but I heard supposed to be really good is the it the friendly one, the 10k in Lichfield.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, yeah, Always want to that. Always want to do that.
right, just to get the tow path.
Yeah,
was, I was a bit gutted that I, well, just, didn't even, because some of these races are like, they pop up and I haven't even heard about them. And then, because I think they're just so so like, so in demand, especially, because as you said, it's rapid.
Ben (:Yeah.
Yeah, I've heard
that one's supposed to be like a rapid one and the only problem is it didn't fit quite well with my training plan and stuff like that but it's one that I would like to do because I haven't like haven't got a like a flat like 10k and I think like my goal now would be to try and run like ⁓ try to get like as close to a sub 40 10k is what I would like to try and do I don't think I'll be able to do that yet
Will Finlay (:Hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah, nice. What have you
run at the minute? 42 something, is it? Yeah. But, you're laughing.
Ben (:something like that yeah like no it
think might be four i think it's 44 i think it's 44 for like for i think that was last year at aldridge so
Will Finlay (:for you.
But I bet you
wouldn't have thought you would have got near 20 minutes when you were at 24. So it's like, you know, never say never.
Ben (:So I said my goals, want to get, after I've done this, that want to get into the 18 minutes of 5k. And I think because of the base of, so I did on Christmas day, I got 19 minutes 31. And that was like a massive PB. I took like 40 seconds off it because I hadn't run like a flat out one for a while. But I think like, because I've got all this training now, I think I would be able to get to that level. Like that'd be like a dream to try and get like an 18 minutes something.
Will Finlay (:Nice. What, what everyone's okay?
Nice.
Okay.
Yeah, brilliant.
and
Yeah,
well that's what this is about. I think it's three, three 40, three 48. I think, I think you could, you could do that especially because, because the thing I find as well is this is obviously the second year where I've been marathon training and don't get me wrong. I love the day of the marathon and there is times where I do really enjoy the training and stuff like that. What I don't like is the sort of all the, as you said, where it didn't fit into your plan, all the races I'm missing out on in between.
Ben (:Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Will Finlay (:And
you feel like, like I haven't run a PB over five or 10K for over a year because it's like you're just not in the shape to do it.
Ben (:And you don't want
to blow it out, do you? You don't want to go and do that knowing that tomorrow I've got to go and run like 16k. And it's just going to mess up your training and such, isn't it? I think that's the... I do get that. I would say that, yes, I agree with you, what you said about some of the training. I actually enjoy my tempo runs. I don't know if it's like you are absolutely shattered. said, like today I've got to do 800 meters at 345 repeated six times.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Absolutely.
Yeah, yeah.
Okay, Whoa, come on, wait a second.
Ben (:Like, no it's not nice, but I will finish it.
I'll finish it and I'll be like, actually that was alright.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, yeah.
Because it's nice where it's like, right, I've only got to run for 800 and then get it done. Yeah. Yeah.
Ben (:Yeah, I've got 90 second rest and then I've got, and then
the worst bit I find on those tempo runs is my two, like the two and a half K warmup. I'm like, don't, I don't want to do the warmup. I just want to get into it. Yeah.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, it's just romantic, yeah. Yeah, I
what you mean. Yeah, so I'm just looking at the time and I think it's slowly time to wrap it up, but it's been great to chat about it. And what I was gonna ask is have you, you obviously spoke about your shoes, have you picked out a race kit for Manchester? Or is it like, I'm just thinking, you going, so you're going full Nike, is that the plan?
Ben (:No, so the irony is trainers, yes. Outfit wise, it will not be like that. So I've got, well I've got, so I've obviously got the bright red trainers. I've got some like red tie-dye socks that go with it. So I've got those ones that are there. And in daft I already know my outfits. I've got some like Gymshark, like, what you call it, camo shorts. But they're like black and grey and white ones, like those ones. Those are my shorts.
Will Finlay (:Okay.
It's just as beautiful as you can get.
Yeah,
Yeah.
Ben (:And
I've got an Adidas Khaki t-shirt just because it's really thin. It's really thin. So I'm like, that's what I've... And obviously I have a vest that I wear because I don't like putting my phone in my pocket. like putting it in the vest in terms of that. So in terms of my outfit, I know that's what I'm going to wear. Yeah, yeah. So because I've done... You want to try and stand out, but not stand out too much, don't you? That's the thing.
Will Finlay (:It's the best bit putting your outfit out the day before because it's like in a picture of it.
Yeah, yeah, nice.
Yeah, are you going up the night before or are you going up on the day?
Ben (:Yeah, yeah. we booked it well in advance before everything got confirmed. So we topping up the night before, booked a meal the night before already. I said the only issue is the person I'm supposed to be doing it with, she's basically told me she's not doing it because she's not been able to train and not run. But like, so there's like me, her, her husband and my partner. So those three will be like cheering me on throughout the day, I think. So they'll be finding where I'm running and stuff like that. So it'll be quite good. Like I said,
Will Finlay (:Really.
Thanks.
Ben (:When I did the first half, I didn't pay attention to the spectators because I was like dead dying. Last time, when I won I did last year, I saw my partner at three different locations because I was looking at him and stuff like that. So I think that, I don't know how I'll be in the marathon.
Will Finlay (:Yeah, brilliant.
No, the crowd has dragged you through and obviously London was Ramo last year, it's like, especially when you see like, I didn't see my mum and dad until 25 miles. That was their own incompetence. they were meant to see me at mile nine and then it was like, anyway, they didn't. But no, like, it definitely spurs you on. And I don't think you could get like ⁓ a better marathon than Manchester because it's so flat. It's like, it's... ⁓
Ben (:Yeah.
god.
Will Finlay (:I think you've got one hill at something like mile 16, which apparently is a bit of a rise, but I think, you you've got, have you got a time that you're thinking of or have you sort of refrained from thinking about that?
Ben (:Well, my plans that I can do in 306 to 314, like that's unrealistic, that's 430 a K, like that's not, I want to run sub 330, that's what I want. So I know that's like 445 a K, so I think that's potential that I can do. Effectively, that's my dream time under 330, I'd be happy.
Will Finlay (:Okay.
Okay.
Ben (:if I did it in like 330 to 345. Obviously if I finished I'd be at like what it is like. So I bought 330 is what I wanna do it in and under. So that's my goal. As I said.
Will Finlay (:Well
I think with a half marathon time like 1.36, it's definitely there, do know what mean? It's what happens on the day, isn't it? Because the last thing I was going to ask you is what's your fueling been like in terms of have you been taking gels and stuff like that? Because it's something that I definitely struggle with, is the stomaching of gels.
Ben (:Yeah.
Yeah.
So yeah, I have. So I've got the gels and I do use them. So on my longer runs, like my 28 Ks, I've started to then take them at like seven, because I'm planning on taking them every seven Ks roughly. So when I've done my 28 Ks, I've done three gels. So I said on the weekend, I'm going to have taken four because it'll be all of run past the 28 Ks and that.
So in terms of that, the gels are okay. think your stomach afterwards isn't great. I'm always like, can't eat properly afterwards, I would say, after taking a of them. It's not the actual like, whatever, I think you just subside your hunger a bit. And then obviously I always run, so when I run those distances, because obviously out on the roads, I take a leukazide in my hand and I put one in my vest. So I make sure I try and drink two leukazides as I'm running around as well.
Will Finlay (:Yeah.
Yeah, you just find out, you and just...
Ben (:I'd say, I don't know what you're like with drinking when you're training. I'm crapping it. don't... My only thing was question for you, sorry, was, but you're doing the Paris one, but you're not going be able to take bottles, you? So what's your plan for that?
Will Finlay (:Yeah, not good.
No, no,
it's well, it's so, you know, it was it came out when was it like, was it? Yeah, two months ago, maybe or a month ago. And like, I remember London last year from the 30K on this, but obviously it was like 24 degrees in London. It was so hot. But I had a bottle of like Buxton water in my hand for like every station on it. And it's like
Ben (:was a godly blessing a month ago I would say. Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Will Finlay (:I sort of look at it and I think, geez, I'm going to struggle without water because it's, and I don't know, like they've done it to reduce the crowding. And I sort of think, right, so you're reducing the crowding, but then what's going to happen when, you know, there was loads of people that collapsed at London and people collapsed every year. And it's always because of dehydration and not enough fueling. you sort of, you know, taking out one thing where people are going to, could fall over, but you're to have people collapsing who aren't drinking enough.
Ben (:Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, and all that lot.
Will Finlay (:To
be honest, in terms of that, I've had these gels are what I use. I've just got a spare one. They're the ones I use, like the beta fuel ones, which have got like, they've got way more carbs in them. But I've been trying to be honest, just have sweets.
Ben (:Okay, yeah.
Yeah,
I've never ate one of Ran's, so I've just stuck to, I've done the gels for the half. I think I'll just stick with that, because I think I'm a bit too late now to try and change what I need, yeah. Oh yes.
Will Finlay (:Yeah.
try to change it.
It's a race day will be what race day is so yeah but I think that's a good spot to wrap it up and it's been, I used to speak to you about it and I wish you all the very best with it. one. Thank you very much. Cheers. See you later.
Ben (:Yeah, perfect.
Same for you mate, good luck in yours. that's... And always mate, cheers. See you later.
